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Post by fishboy on Aug 16, 2010 21:19:53 GMT -5
Registered!! I think I forgot to tell you it was for 40K though hehe.
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Post by jay on Aug 17, 2010 12:13:04 GMT -5
The DaBoyz GT site has been updated. We might be doing some Tweaks in the future depending on how the Primers turn out.
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Post by hyv3mynd on Aug 18, 2010 7:28:26 GMT -5
Just some notes on the info packet.
Best General will be BP + Comp?
"All armies should be assembled, primed, painted with three colors and based to receive a minimum score. Armies that do not fulfill this minimum standard may be played however a score of zero will be entered in this category."
then...
"• All models in your army must be painted and have finished bases. Models that do not make the minimum standards may not be used. Bringing an unpainted army doesn't just mean a zero in painting. It also means you don't play. You do not have to paint your army, but if you did not paint your own army then you can receive Overall Appearance award for your army."
Sounds like a contradiction to me. Is it realistic to demand fully painted and BASED armies to even play? Are you going to refund costs to people who are DQ'd for not having based models? What's your public relations stance going to be if this results in multiple players being removed from the tournament? I've never been to a GT, but is expecting 80 players with 3 color painting and fully based realistic?
" If illegal units or rules violations are found in a player's list, at a minimum, the models in violation will be removed from all subsequent play. Tournament points may be deducted and award eligibility may be forfeited. Please use the feedback form on this website to ask any questions you or your club may have regarding rules issues or legal units in advance!"
This statement appears 3 times in the basic rule section.
Just stuff that hit my radar when I read through. Hope it helps.
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Garou24
Chapter Master
Posts: 1,530
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Post by Garou24 on Aug 18, 2010 8:35:49 GMT -5
While disqualification might be a little on the extreme side for unpainted models. Most people have know about this GT for a year now, and known that it will put a heavy emphasis on Comp and painting as well as battle points. I don't see that its too much to ask that a player bring 1850 points of three color models that are based to a Grand Tournament they have known about for a year.
**Thats just my opinion and is in no way official.**
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Post by hyv3mynd on Aug 18, 2010 8:52:56 GMT -5
Well for people like me who have only been playing 5 months and have a full time job, gf, dogs, etc. painting and basing ~75 models is another full time job.
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Post by netter on Aug 18, 2010 11:28:43 GMT -5
Tournaments will always vary with respect to painting requirements. Personally, I like to play painted armies at tournament. It doesn't matter if it's not the Mona Lisa, so long as it's done. It is a hobby. Maybe you could convice your gf to base your models and take care of the dogs... Netter
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Post by hyv3mynd on Aug 18, 2010 11:54:57 GMT -5
Ill do what I need to for the gt. Don't want to get into a battle defending my lifestyle. Just saying you have two contradictory statements in the info packet. One says you can play with unfinished models, just with a 0 paint score, the other says you can't even play.
Only my opinion that the latter is a bit harsh and could deter a lot of players and I could be wrong.
In a field of 80 players, there will invariably be some who skimmed the rules packet or don't have 100% based models. What's the plan then? Thanks for the $50 and spending 3 hours on the road, you can pack up and leave now.
Also iirc, the previous comp packet said names will be removed from lists and armies will be comp scored anonymously. Now, judges will be scoring during the tourney according to the new packet. This opens up a can of subective comp drama with potential for people to feel screwed over. Ask steve or jeremy what it feels like to be docked points for no good reason. This is even exaggerated by the fact that comp is now a part of the "best general" and every other prize bracket.
Like I said, only my opinion, but all these changes seem to be giving the gt a very unwelcoming air to it. Don't come if you aren't painted and based. Don't come if you don't play a comp list (even though dupes, trips, sc's are legal codex choices). Seems like you may get just that, a lot of people who don't come.
Not speaking for myself, I can still stomp with a comp list and will do everything in my power to finish painting and basing. Just trying to help get good attendance and people happy with the event.
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Garou24
Chapter Master
Posts: 1,530
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Post by Garou24 on Aug 18, 2010 12:08:05 GMT -5
I agree that not being able to play is a little harsh for unpainted or based models. I said that in my above post. I feel the painting score of 0 should apply here. Hopefully Jay can re-read the packet and update the info so it is a little easier to read. There are a few parts where information is a little vague.
As far as skimming the packet.. well while I agree its not the easiest read... if the player has any questions they have the link and Jay's email. They can post here or email for more info. If some is paying $40 and driving 3 hours... I hope they have the common sense to read the tournament info and ask any questions ahead of time. Its a 50/50 split. the Organizers need to make sure the info is clear and easy to access. But the player needs to make sure they have read the information and address any concerns of their own.
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Post by carlosthecraven on Aug 18, 2010 12:17:20 GMT -5
Hi
I'll throw my two cents in favour of 3 colour minumum to be used at the event.
If I am paying to play, I want my opponent's stuff to have some colour. It is part of the quality of the experience to play against decent looking armies.
Cheers, Nate
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Post by jay on Aug 18, 2010 13:20:15 GMT -5
In my haste, I might have posted the packet too early. There are some typos and other grammar issues. I will be revising it in the next couple of day.
Most people want to play against painted armies, especially if travel a cross the US to play in our event. Last year we let people in with unpainted armies, but going forward the stance we wanted was to only allow painted armies. The idea was you have over a year to finish painting your army to prepare for next year. Hyv3mynd you are in different league. A good player, but only had been playing for 5 to 6 months. You have not had the last 12 months to paint your army. It is also not a small marine army. I will ask the council if they would allow unpainted armies at our event. Maybe we can do a 80% rule.
We would never really kick out someone that drove 3 hours and showed up with unpainted stuff.
To answer some of your other questions most GT’s only allow painted armies. The only event I know of is the Ard Boyz that does not require painting.
You are correct Best General is battle and Composition combined.
Composition will still be judge beforehand, except for if we had people show up at the door. All names will be removed (by me) and then sent to comp panel for review.
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Post by hyv3mynd on Aug 18, 2010 13:32:27 GMT -5
Cool jay.
I'm not opposed to the painting requirement so much as concerned for possibly scaring folks away. There's still 3 months to go also. I guess it just comes from 40k night at mg and boldos where I've seen almost no finished and based armies allthough I'm sure some have armies sitting at home ready to go.
Mostly just trying to help get the info packet in line. Ill support and play whatever format is finalized for the gt.
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Post by carlosthecraven on Aug 18, 2010 14:25:43 GMT -5
Hi
A couple of points to throw into the discussion.
Point 1. I have found that painting an army requires a goal with a hard deadline.
For me, high quality tournaments that demand fully painted tournaments - like Adepticon, Warmasters, and (hopefully) Da Boyz - are what galvanize me into action. I got 1000 points of my new Orks done for Adepticon. I plan to get the remaining 850 done for DaBoyz GT.
I encourage you to use this opportunity to do the same.
Point 2: I would also put down the counter-point that for those travelling, the lack of a painting requirement is a scary prospect. Having to pay to play, pay to travel, and pay for a hotel and food is an equation that needs to be measured against the quality of the event in question.
The things that go into that equation for me: - Are the hosts friendly and open with their communications? - Are the scenarios known and do I like them/the scoring structure? - Is the terrain at least good, if not great? (Do the organizers know how to place terrain in a fair and interesting manner?) - Will I be playing against mostly painted armies or will I be playing against proxied, unpainted models?
My experience last year at DaBoyz was very positive, as all these criteria were met with flying colours. Next to Adepticon, it is my favourite tournament that I play in.
However, if I were to experience a slow decline in any of these areas, my determination to make it one of the key events on my gaming schedule would decline proportionately.
Cheers, Nate
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Post by chumbalaya on Aug 18, 2010 19:08:28 GMT -5
3 Color Minimum is a daunting prospect, for sure, but even I managed to get it done for Nova Considering that a 0 painting score takes you out of contention for a lot of loot (maybe everything but raffles?), allowing unpainted/unbased models wouldn't really do much more than allow people to come. It's a whole different kettle of fish to tell somebody they can't win any prizes than they can't play at all.
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Post by hyv3mynd on Aug 21, 2010 16:08:15 GMT -5
Just proofreading the packet again.
Page 7 right side. Sportsmanship listed as 50, then 60 points. Description is stil 25+25=50.
Page 12/basic rules. Bullets 1,6 are clones. Bullets 7, 10 are redundant.
Reguarding Friday night setup/open play. I'd recommend a challenge night sinilar to NOVA. Give some big names/loud mouths/internet celebs a chance to face off. I'd love a chance to throw down against any of the ETC members that come or any of the Dakka dudes.
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Post by fishboy on Aug 23, 2010 18:25:03 GMT -5
Jay to win best painted I would assume you have to paint your own army correct?
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