Smitty
Sergeant
Marines die, thats what we're here for, But the Marine Corps lives 4ever & that means YOU live 4ever
Posts: 324
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Post by Smitty on Oct 18, 2012 7:42:41 GMT -5
Hey guys does anyone have recommendations for squad sizes for Screamers and Flamer? Trying to hit sacred number of 9 seams like over kill for the squad but does work for buying them.
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Post by grubnards on Oct 18, 2012 7:52:23 GMT -5
I'm sure Erich will have advice on that as he was pretty successful with running them this past weekend. I want to say he had like 6 flamers and at least 9 screamers but I'm going off of old man memory.
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sinistermind
Sergeant
Dice, the perfect example of a love/hate relationship
Posts: 315
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Post by sinistermind on Oct 18, 2012 7:57:07 GMT -5
0...for each ;D
but really how about lucky 7?
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Post by warmasterprimus on Oct 18, 2012 11:32:32 GMT -5
I never did get a hold of the new daemon rules. What's so hot about the new screamers & flamers?
The only thing I know is that they kinda got boned in fantasy.
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Smitty
Sergeant
Marines die, thats what we're here for, But the Marine Corps lives 4ever & that means YOU live 4ever
Posts: 324
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Post by Smitty on Oct 18, 2012 11:57:41 GMT -5
I'm doing a thousand-sons army allied with Tzeentch daemons. Looking at points its pretty pricy so don't think there will be much to the army so I'll probably get my butt kicked. Theme wise I thought it would be pretty cool.
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Post by hyv3mynd on Oct 18, 2012 12:04:04 GMT -5
I never did get a hold of the new daemon rules. What's so hot about the new screamers & flamers? The only thing I know is that they kinda got boned in fantasy. Point reduction, each model has 2 wounds each now, and removal of fearless wounds in assault make them much better. Screamers can turbo-boost (jetbike) the turn they arrive gaining 4+ cover and causing wounds on a unit they pass over. Plus, they're str5 ap2 and armorbane now so they eat infantry, terminators, and vehicles alike. Flamers have the template that wounds anything on 4+ and ignores armor. This also makes them extremely dangerous to assault and too dangerous to ignore.
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Post by grubnards on Oct 18, 2012 12:05:21 GMT -5
Smitty@ What about a couple of small pink horrors squad with a bolt of change guy in them?
Chris@ the screamers can move 2d6 (or something) the turn they come in during the shooting phase and they get attacks on units they fly over like the dark eldar bikes do. They were a huge thorn in my side on saturday.
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Smitty
Sergeant
Marines die, thats what we're here for, But the Marine Corps lives 4ever & that means YOU live 4ever
Posts: 324
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Post by Smitty on Oct 18, 2012 12:51:10 GMT -5
Point reduction, each model has 2 wounds each now, and removal of fearless wounds in assault make them much better. Screamers can turbo-boost (jetbike) the turn they arrive gaining 4+ cover and causing wounds on a unit they pass over. Plus, they're str5 ap2 and armorbane now so they eat infantry, terminators, and vehicles alike. Flamers have the template that wounds anything on 4+ and ignores armor. This also makes them extremely dangerous to assault and too dangerous to ignore. I didnt realize they were in that update, I'll have to look at that. @kevin I will have a squad of 9 pink horrors in the list as well Here is what I'm trying to work into the list: PrimaryAhriman Daemon Prince (like the model but not a must) Thousand sons (9x) Thousand sons (9x) CSM Mark Tzeentch (10x rhino) Heldrake (only cause you need fliers) SecondaryLord of Change Flamers (#x?) Pink Horrors (9x) Screamers (#x?) Depending on points I wouldn't mind adding oblits or a dino bot, or termies..
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Post by warmasterprimus on Oct 18, 2012 13:06:18 GMT -5
Hey Smitty,
If you like Thousand Sons fluff, Atlas Infernal (on top of being a good read) has a bit in it. I think Battle for the Fang and the two Heresy books had way more stuff, so don't be expecting anything ground breaking. It's more about what current operations they're running.
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Post by chaoscraig on Oct 18, 2012 17:57:28 GMT -5
also found out the hard way that screamers are strength 5 ap 2 with 2 attacks base. they like to eat plague marines it turns out.
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sinistermind
Sergeant
Dice, the perfect example of a love/hate relationship
Posts: 315
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Post by sinistermind on Oct 18, 2012 21:12:14 GMT -5
also found out the hard way that screamers are strength 5 ap 2 with 2 attacks base. they like to eat plague marines it turns out. S5 ap2 2 attacks(3 since they will almost always charge) in close combat and they are jetbike fast? And get vector strikes so to speak? Thats..interesting @ smitty looks like a cool list that would be fun to play
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Post by professor on Oct 19, 2012 9:25:35 GMT -5
I may be wrong - but I believe the relevant statlines for Screamers/Flamers are:
Flamers: S/T 4 W 2 Sv: 5++ Eternal Warrior, Jump Infantry w/ Breath of Chaos: Wound/glance on a 4+
I run Flamers in units of 6 usually - that seems to be enough of them to do damage and you can only really shoot 4 or 5 of them the first turn. That is, unless you put a Herald of Tzeetch on a Disc with them - then you can drop around a large flying base and get all 6 of them in. That is actually my favorite setup for them and it is probably the most flexible. The herald gets Bolt, Master of Sorcery (fire 2 weapons), We are Legion (choose multiple targets).
Screamers have the satlines WS - 4 S - 5 T/I - 4 A - 3 W - 2 Sv - 5++
Eternal Warrior, Jetbikes w/ Warp Jaws (S5 AP2, Armourbane).
I run a unit of 9 because it is the Tzeetch Number and it results in a ton of Slashing Attack hits. By the way, they have Slashing Attacks which inflict d3 S4 AP - hits per model that turbo boosts over an enemy unit in the shooting phase. Vehicles hit on Side Armor so you can wreck Chimeras, Venoms and some flyers with this.
You CAN turbo boost the turn after you land. A Jetbike Turbo Boosts 24". Screamers are absolutely awesome now - I like top drop them in relatively close and then Turbo Boost over an enemy - returning to be in fateweaver range or to put them within 1" of vehicles/troops to they cannot really move and noone wants to assault that unit.
I know Lords of Change are good - but you might as well bring Fateweaver for the cost. You are going to want Bolt, Gaze and Master of Sorcery on them which already puts the cost near Fates. I would bring in a CSM army just a Herald of Tzeetch kitted as described above.
9x Horrors are decent shooting and I run mine w/o a Bolt. They will lay down the massed anti-infantry fire you want. I wish there was an easy way to give CSM Divination powers to really pump up their shots.
Run your Daemon Prince in the Daemon detachment - it is a heavy support choice. I would kit it with Mark of Tzeetch, Bolt, Gaze, Master of Sorcery, Wings. It is Eternal Warrior, has a 4++ save can flyby a unit to Vector Strike and then shoot at another.
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Post by jhobin on Oct 19, 2012 10:18:35 GMT -5
I really dig the list a lot.
I was thinking of trying something similar down here at a tourney in January. I was thinking 3 or 4 units of 1ksons with a possibility of two x18 man cultist units to babysit objectives.
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Post by fishboy on Oct 22, 2012 8:54:02 GMT -5
The Demon list I am working on I originally wanted 6-7 flamers and screamers in a unit. Problem is I ran into points issues so I shrunk everything down to 5 man units.
At BFS I played 2 demon lists with 5 and 6 man units and they did very very well.
Armourbane on the Screamers is nasty hehe.
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Post by chaoscraig on Oct 24, 2012 16:22:33 GMT -5
so i hearing that the new daemon rule in the rulebook trumps the one in the codex wich takes away the immunity to instant death. true or false?
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