Post by johnboo on Jan 30, 2009 9:15:12 GMT -5
Soooo...
this nice little "rules as written" nugget has shown up just in time for my lizardmen. Skink/krox units and salamander/skink handlers get to count their whole unit strength toward fear & outnumbering!
To quote from www.lustria-online.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=523
"There was a discussion over at the Pyramid Vault about what US you count for outnumbering in combat for units of Salamanders/Razordons and the new Krox-skink unit.
many people said you only count the US of the Fear-causing models for the auto-break, but I was quick to point out that on page 50 of the main rule book, it state in the last paragraph, "Units in CC automatically fail their Break test if they are defeated by an enemy that they Fear and the combined US on the losing side is lower than the combined US of all Fear-causing *units* on the winning side."
Do Salamanders cause fear? Yes
Are the Salamanders and Skinks a sinlge unit? Yes
What is the US of a unit of 3 Salamanders packs(9 skinks, 3 Salamanders)? 18
So if we can agree that the above 3 statements are true, then why wouldn't a Salamander pack (which causes fear) count its entire US of 18 for outnumbering in combat since it is 1 unit, not a unit of Salamanders and a unit of Skinks.
We just could not come to an agreement on this matter as the book only deals with mixed units in the character section (pg 78). But these Fear-causing creatures are not characters, and thus you have to count their unit's US, not just that of the creatures. After all, Salamanders and skinks are not seperate units."
and
"Adding a Character that causes fear does not make the whole unit cause fear. Check out page 78 in the BRB. For most purposes, the unit is immune to fear and if the enemy will contact the fear-causing model, then they test for fear.
But when calculating Fear-causing units, the Character is counted as a seperate unit in combat, and would thus not outnumber for auto-break.
Krox/skink units would outnumber since you can't count US for the Krox and ignore the rest of their unit."
Huh. And who says I dont like 7th edition....Rules are tight! ;D
I guess the big question is whether this is addressed specifically in the new lizardmen book.
this nice little "rules as written" nugget has shown up just in time for my lizardmen. Skink/krox units and salamander/skink handlers get to count their whole unit strength toward fear & outnumbering!
To quote from www.lustria-online.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=523
"There was a discussion over at the Pyramid Vault about what US you count for outnumbering in combat for units of Salamanders/Razordons and the new Krox-skink unit.
many people said you only count the US of the Fear-causing models for the auto-break, but I was quick to point out that on page 50 of the main rule book, it state in the last paragraph, "Units in CC automatically fail their Break test if they are defeated by an enemy that they Fear and the combined US on the losing side is lower than the combined US of all Fear-causing *units* on the winning side."
Do Salamanders cause fear? Yes
Are the Salamanders and Skinks a sinlge unit? Yes
What is the US of a unit of 3 Salamanders packs(9 skinks, 3 Salamanders)? 18
So if we can agree that the above 3 statements are true, then why wouldn't a Salamander pack (which causes fear) count its entire US of 18 for outnumbering in combat since it is 1 unit, not a unit of Salamanders and a unit of Skinks.
We just could not come to an agreement on this matter as the book only deals with mixed units in the character section (pg 78). But these Fear-causing creatures are not characters, and thus you have to count their unit's US, not just that of the creatures. After all, Salamanders and skinks are not seperate units."
and
"Adding a Character that causes fear does not make the whole unit cause fear. Check out page 78 in the BRB. For most purposes, the unit is immune to fear and if the enemy will contact the fear-causing model, then they test for fear.
But when calculating Fear-causing units, the Character is counted as a seperate unit in combat, and would thus not outnumber for auto-break.
Krox/skink units would outnumber since you can't count US for the Krox and ignore the rest of their unit."
Huh. And who says I dont like 7th edition....Rules are tight! ;D
I guess the big question is whether this is addressed specifically in the new lizardmen book.
