Hive Tyrant Armour Save

[jhobin]

All this talk of Nids has me looking at there codex again. A friend of mine in SC plays bugs all the time and he noticed something in the codex he brought up to me awhile ago, but I just remembered about the hive tyrant's armour save.

If you buy the tyrant warp field he gets a 2+ armour save as the description says. If you then buy extended carapace as the wargear says you improve your armour save by +1. This would make your save a 1+. The rules state that a 1 always fails. But if the tyrant is shot by an AP2 weapons would it get an armour save?

I do not think him and I ever played a game that way. I told him heck go for it if you want to spend close to 60 points for a 1+ save knock your self out.

What do you guys think?

[Catachan Colonel]

can you point out were a 1 always fails, cause i think thats only in fantasy.

You can also make a math discention to it.

Warp filel takes whatever your armor save is and turns it into a 2+/6+(i)

we will call it a A=2+/6+(i)

Extended carpase says take your armor save stat and at plus 1
we will call it A+1 (where plusses improve the save)

what we get is A+1= 2+/6+(i)

Warp field gives an absolute value not a modifier

i would allow him to either take his A+1 or his 2+/6+(i) his choice!


this argument is a lot like when do you double strength for a power fist and when do you add +1
in grade school we all learned standard order of opperations. (then again about the beginning of 3rd edition we learned GW English fuzzy logic system)

My personal opinion is because a 1+ does not always fail it would be way to good!
I think if it meant to be just another +1 to your saVe and a 6+ invulnerable they would have wrote it that way.

thats my $0.02

[Norton]

No you do not end up with a 1+ save, the extended carapace adds +1 to your base armor save, then purchassing the warp field replaces whatever your current save is with a 2+/6+ save.

[dragons3]

COLONEL CATACHAN, i OR j IS THE SQUARE ROOT OF A NEGATIVE NUMBER, AN "IMAGINARY NUMBER", BUT DON'T WORRY NEXT TIME YOU'LL HAVE 24 OTHER LETTERS TO CHOOSE FROM.

2+ SAVE IS THE BEST YOU GET, INVULNERABLE OR NORMAL, NO MATTER WHAT. AP1 PERTAINS TO VEHICLES FOR ARMOR PENETRATION PURPOSES ONLY.

BIO MORPHS ARE SELECTED BEFORE HIVE MIND POWERS, EXTENDED CARAPACE DOESN'T APPLY TO WINGED HIVE TYRANTS.
SO ONLY WALKING HIVE TYRANTS COULD HAVE BOTH, AND THATS A WASTE OF POINTS.

SINCE FORMULAS SEEM TO BE AN ISSUE HERE, COUNT THE DOTS ON THE DICE, THE SIDE WITH ONE DOT ALWAYS FAILS.

MY $0.03 CIAO!

[jay]

I believe Norton is right. If a guy is going to do this and try to take 1 plus save, i give him a swift kick in the BALLS.

[jhobin]

Let me just say I am not condoning this move, I like to play devils advocate on rule ambiguties but when presented with people who play this way you have to counter them with proof, or a swift kick in the junk

Where does it say that extended carapace improves your base save and them warp field is applied? why can it not be the other way around?

If I remeber correctly all extended carapace says is it improves your armour save by +1 not when it is applied, also warpfield says it makes the intended model's save 2+ 6+.

That being said if I ran into a person like this in a tourney I would calmly call a judge over ask them what they think. After the judge left I would begin with "I think your armies broken and I am going to tell you why", and the proceed with the junk kicking!

[dragons3]

VIOLENCE IS NOT THE ANSWER, JUST AN OPTION!

DRAGON IS ONE WITH ZEN, AND I CAN NEVER HIT FIRST ANYWAYS!

NORTON AND I AGREE ON THIS ONE, BEEN THROUGH 2 CODEX'S NOW, ENOUGH TIME SPENT, LET IT GO!

CIAO!

[MajorSoB]

Violence is always a good answer and should be considered whenever possible. What Jay said is correct, a swift kick to the nuts should be used to solve this problem, IMO.

[Iron Warrior]

Violence = Answer
Answer = 2+
there fore:
2+ = Violence


Anyone with a 2+ save = swift kick in the junk. ;D
That is all.

[jay]

Violence can be used. Like when you are playing drop pod army without real drop pods. Yea when you opponent is using 7 KFC buckets (the big ones) and you can’t shoot around them.

That is called Face Stabbing Time!!

[popkhorne]

LOL, KFC buckets... I have to try that! I think I may go as far as painting an amry in the colors of KFC to match!
I'm going to use mash potatoe containers for dreadnaughts, and the small personal meal sized boxes as rhino's..... oh, I will do sanders pround!!!!